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Is manually setting the bitrate in Nero Recode 2014 not working?

I have a video that I have set to 200kbp/s which should hive me a file size of around 900kb total. What I always end up with, no matter what setting I pick is a 2,000kb file endoded at 500kbp/s. This will not suit my needs. Can anyone help me resolve this?
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  • Out of Curiosity I tried my old copy of Nero Recode version 4.8.1 and it did the job perfectly. The reason I can't just use that is there appears to be some sort of bug in 4.8.1 that forces the video to be cropped in a way that I don't want. Recode 2014 does not have that limitation but I will not be able to use it either if I can't get the file sizes down.
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    Recode 4.8.1 is out of date but, I can't adjust the bit rate in it. You can disable Crop and Resizing there and possibly avoid the limitation you're getting. I'm not sure what that will do to the resulting output video in regards to quality.

    I think what you actually get, disregarding what it's estimating, depends on the video format within the .avi and the target output (mpeg-4, in this case). Our forum video expert, Mister_M, could probably answer this question easily but he's a working man and has been swamped lately.

    If no one else responds, I recommend that you send an e-mail to tech support at techsupport@nero.com. If you do, let us know what they have to say.
    • Wither, you can adjust the bitrate in 4.8.1 with the slider and text input. I did have the crop and resize set to "disable" but it cropped it anyway. I just presumed this was a bug that was fixed so I paid for Recode 2014. Sure enough now I don't have any problems there but I can't get the file sizes to match what I can get in 4.8.1.

      I'm excited to hear what Mister_M has to say. :-)

      I have e-mailed techsupport. I hope to hear from them soon.

      In the mean time I have tried out Miro video encoder and it has produced the quality and file sizes that I need. I would much prefer to use Nero because I have been using it for years and years and am familiar with the settings. . . wich. . . are totally lacking in Miro. . . but. . . I also have a client that is itchy for me to deliver so I have to use what works. :-(
    • I had tried using the slider with the file I imported and it wouldn't move. Also note that I am using 4.10 which is an update to 4.8. When I was testing earlier in v14, I had tried the constant bit rate suggested later by Mister_M and it reduced the size of the output file by about 10%.
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  • I will look at this case more closely, when I'm at the hotel tonight.
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  • You set the video bit rate mode to average bit rate. You could try the constant bit rate mode and see if it works then. Only cropping the picture (or lowering the resolution) without further adjusting of the video bit rate wouldn't lead to a smaller file size in any way, because the amount of data per time period would stay the same.

    Using average or variable bit rates can lead to bigger file sizes than originally predicted depending on the picture content of the source video. You can't really control the output file size with these settings.

    Instead of adjusting the bit rate slider, you could use the "Fit to target" option on the left and manually type 1 MB into the field.

    Unfortunately I can't test this before Thursday night because I'm not allowed to install private software on my firm's notebook.
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  • When the slider at 200 kbps gives you 500 kbps, did you try to set it even lower? At least as a workaround.
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    William,

    I tried a little test using Nero 2014 Recode to recode a file I made with Nero 2014 Video. I think my results mirror yours:



    Here's the MediaInfo for the recoded file:

    General
    Complete name : D:\Nero Output\Recode\From_20140513_AVC_1280x720_15fps_NoAudio.mp4
    Format : MPEG-4
    Format profile : Base Media / Version 2
    Codec ID : mp42
    File size : 3.10 MiB
    Duration : 35s 669ms
    Overall bit rate mode : Variable
    Overall bit rate : 728 Kbps
    Encoded date : UTC 2014-05-14 00:39:26
    Tagged date : UTC 2014-05-14 00:39:28

    Video
    ID : 1
    Format : AVC
    Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
    Format profile : Main@L3.1
    Format settings, CABAC : Yes
    Format settings, ReFrames : 1 frame
    Codec ID : avc1
    Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
    Duration : 35s 400ms
    Duration_LastFrame : 133ms
    Bit rate mode : Constant
    Bit rate : 660 Kbps
    Maximum bit rate : 1 454 Kbps
    Width : 960 pixels
    Height : 544 pixels
    Display aspect ratio : 16:9
    Original display aspect ratio : 16:9
    Frame rate mode : Constant
    Frame rate : 15.000 fps
    Color space : YUV
    Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
    Bit depth : 8 bits
    Scan type : Progressive
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.084
    Stream size : 2.74 MiB (89%)
    Language : English
    Encoded date : UTC 2014-05-14 00:39:26
    Tagged date : UTC 2014-05-14 00:39:28

    Audio
    ID : 2
    Format : AAC
    Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
    Format profile : LC
    Codec ID : 40
    Duration : 35s 669ms
    Bit rate mode : Variable
    Bit rate : 80.0 Kbps
    Maximum bit rate : 81.9 Kbps
    Channel(s) : 2 channels
    Channel positions : Front: L R
    Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
    Compression mode : Lossy
    Stream size : 348 KiB (11%)
    Title : und
    Encoded date : UTC 2014-05-14 00:39:26
    Tagged date : UTC 2014-05-14 00:39:28

    Menu
    00:00:00.000 : Start


    Lowering the bit rate from 200 Kbps to the minimum (55 Kbps) changed nothing!

    If anyone wants to experiment here is my Recode input file

    Another edit to add the encoder settings I used to adjust the resolution:
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    Another Little Test

    I tried with a larger file, different resolution, etc. Using the lowest quality setting and hardware acceleration, Recode actually produced a larger file than the source! Without hardware acceleration, the output file is 4 times larger than the estimate.

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  • I think that Nero wants to assure a certain quality for the output video.

    I used the Windows sample video wildlife.wmv, which has a bit rate of 5.9 MBit/s (VC-1, resolution 1280x720) and has a file size of 25 MB.

    I compared the the output of Nero Recode 4.10.10700.5.100 (Nero 10 Platinum HD) and Nero Recode 2014 (15.0.25000).

    In both cases I used the same encoding parameters:
    H.264 (AVC), lowest possible video bit rate, Lanczos, no resolution change, 2-pass high quality encoding.

    Here's the comparison (zoom in the pictures to see the difference):
    Original:
    Video: VC-1, 1280x720, 29.97 fps, 5.9 MBit/s
    Audio: WMA 9.2, 192 kbps, 44 kHz, stereo, CBR
    File size: 25 MB


    Nero Recode 2014:
    Video: H.264, 1280x720, 29.97 fps, 1.1 MBit/s (adjusted to 193 kbps in Recode)
    Audio: AAC, 96 kbps, 44 kHz, stereo, ABR
    File size: 4.29 MB


    Nero Recode 4:
    Video: H.264, 1280x720, 29.97 fps, 249 kbps (adjusted to 200 kbps in Recode)
    Audio: AAC, 96 kbps, 44 kHz, stereo, CBR
    File size: 1.24 MB


    Besides the output file size problem I have one question: Why would one lower the video bit rate that extremely? Your original video has 30.4 MBit/s. Lowering that bit rate to 200 kbps without altering the resolution will end up in a picture quality mess, as you can see above...

    So my assumption is like I wrote in my first sentence: Assuring a certain amount of quality.

    @ Omega Tester: That the hardware accelerated output is larger is totally normal, since the algorithms don't work as precise as the ones of software encoding. This is an all known issue. Here you have to decide between file size (and picture quality) or speed. Nevertheless the output shouldn't be larger than the input. ;)
    • Thanks for the examples. It would be nice to have an explanation of this phenomenon from Nero. The quality assurance argument is a possibility, but if true, is poorly implemented. If the user's wishes are not to be complied with, it would seem appropriate to present an "Are your sure ..." dialog warning of the problem. Personally, I suspect that it is simply an error since the minimum quality is restricted as you have noted.

      Your low bitrate example has an artistic look to it! Maybe that's desirable by some?
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  • Mister_M- your results exactly reproduced what I found earlier with a different video.

    I also don't have a video with the low framerate such as William has thus, I didn't feel that setting Recode correspondingly using a video which has a higher framerate would be useful.

    I think William should address this with tech support.
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  • Here's what I (think I) found: after encoding over-and-over again with the 35sec sample video provided by William, files below some threshold bitrate (not merely the original bitrate in this case 600kbps) will assume some minimum bitrate or close proximity...I kept getting 1049Kbps out of my 12.5.6 recode.

    However, when I go above say 1500 kbps I get what I ask for -- i,.e. my output file is as the UI specifies (1.5Mbps).

    I did 6 or 7 examples and they all used Lanczos, 2-pass High-Profile without CPU assist and CONSTANT bit-rate of my choosing (or so I thought!) then consistently checked using MediaInfo as you all have done.

    Next, I took off the High-profile and removed Lanczos just trying to get a low-speed encode. With the GPU turned on, I couldn't get below 490kbps, and WITH GPU ACCELERATION OFF, I couldn't get below 1049kbps no matter what I tried!

    For me, the good news is I never recode as low (200kbs) as W.B. E. is trying to encode, and over 1.5M it seems to work predictably in 12.5.6.

    Hope this adds to the solution rather than the mystery!

    JasonInVegas
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  • im having the same problem, no matter what I do the maximum bit rate is set to 20,000 rendering it unable to burn to any disk
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